Money utility: Several months ago when I last met Ctein in Madison—May, it was—he had with him a Panasonic 12–35mm lens that John Camp had loaned him. I put it on my OM-D E-M1 and was instantly smitten: it seemed just the right lens for that camera to me. I love the optical look of that lens, too. (Or at least I think I do. It could be that I'm just falling prey to suggestibility, looking at online samples and letting my imagination fill in what I want to be seeing.)
I intended to get one. But shortly thereafter, stocks of that lens ran out. It's been back-ordered at B&H Photo for months. (We forget, but Panasonic does this regularly with various products.)
Then reader B.R. George pointed out something very interesting yesterday, which is that the entire Panasonic LX100 costs $100 less than the Panasonic 12–35mm zoom lens alone...and the lens on the LX100 is slightly faster and has slightly greater range than the standalone lens to boot. So it's like they're throwing in the entire camera for free, and then some.
And that's from the same company.
Between different companies, the contrast is even greater. A similar thought occurred to me when Jack MacDonough brought his Leica T by the house recently—much as I liked the T, in comparison with my utilitarian Sony NEX-6 it reminded me of that super lightweight Porsche which they took a lot of and then charged more for. Slick as the T is (and it's beautiful, a work of art), it omits a number of features that I want, and that I like—and that I get to have on the Sony. And yet the Leica costs fives times what the Sony (admittedly, on closeout) is currently going for. The value equation is...disparate.
Digital can be enormously expensive...but it can also be remarkably cheap. All you have to do is be willing to buy a less popular camera once it reaches end-of-lifecycle closeout. You can't be too picky if you're looking for the best deal, but the argument could be made that you don't need to be, because so many cameras are so competent these days. As B.R. George and the curious case of the LX100 vs. 12–35mm zoom reminds us, the money utility equation with this stuff is all over the place.
For another case in point, consider that the Leica T's initial lens offering, the Summicron-T 23mm ƒ/2 ASPH, is being manufactured by a no-name Pacific-rim OEM optical supplier. (Something Leica admits while also declining to name names.) It's ideally spec'd by my lights, and a better size than my Zeiss equivalent, but, considering that provenance, and its ~$2k pricetag, that lens also comes with a very thick built-in padding of profit margin. No, not for you.
Canon hates Canon: A while back I was trying to get an answer to a question out of Hewlett-Packard, and I doggedly put in a number of calls to a number of different HP employees. One development that amused me was the way some of those people talked about the company they worked for...as though it were monolithic, and as though it had independent will. "HP might want you to do this, or HP might want you to do that," one of them told me (I paraphrase of course). "I'm not really sure what HP would want. You'd have to talk to HP."
And I thought, wait a minute here...I am talking to HP. Right now. To me, you're HP.
Camera hobbyists make the same mistake in talking about camera companies. Canon this and Nikon that. As if companies speak with one united voice and have completely harmonious unanimity of intent. Actually, what impresses me whenenver I hear stories from the other side of the curtain is how bitter and extreme the infighting between divisions and even within divisions of the same company can be. Recently I heard a rumor that the camera division of a certain CWSNBN (company which shall not be named) developed a whole different technology to do something that the same company's video division had already developed the leading tech for doing. Why go to the trouble? The camera division didn't want the video division to get credit for the feature within the company.
I always got that same impression when I dealt with the old Kodak during its swan song days, too. Internal corporate culture was far more important to people at Kodak in those days than external relations between Kodak and other companies or the outside world. The same is true within camera companies, too. We should remind ourselves from time to time that when we talk about these entities like they're unified and speak with a single voice, we're taking liberties, using shorthand.
Gaaaaaah scary: I realized four years ago that if I ever wanted to buy a house, I was just going to have to save up a lot of money. I don't have a regular job with a regular company and banks were looking at me like I was a fly-by-night hippie artist type with no visible means of support (well...). So I saved up for more than three years to make this move. It was the only way I could do it.
Since the move started happening, though, it's been like I punched a hole in the bucket of my bank account and the money has been gushing merrily out. The former owners of this house took their washer and dryer with them...it was in the contract, of course, but I'd missed it. What are you going to do? You have to be able to wash your clothes. I bought the fourth tier down in the Samsung line, but it still cost a frightening $1,450 by the time all was said and done. Every time I turn around it's another four hundred dollars for this, another thousand dollars for that.
Currently, I own, and am paying for, two houses...and until I get the old one safely sold I am not out of the woods financially. But the old house needs to be fixed up before it can be sold. Not only are we weeks away from finishing that project, but it's proving to be another sizeable leak in the money-bucket. Painting, new closet doors, new light fixtures, the pool table mechanic for the pool table move, new flooring throughout the house...can you hear me say "ouch"? When Zander first started carrying a house key, at age 14 or 15, he'd forget it sometimes, and he used to climb in though a kitchen window when he locked himself out. We (not he, I can't blame him) ended up leaving the screens and storm windows off that window, so now it needs to be replaced. It never ends!
Scary. I benefitted from that on this end—the former owners fixed up this house splendidly. On the other end—well, now it's my turn.
It's a guy thing: I kinda have to laugh at myself, because, at the old house, I kept up very well with the guy stuff: the mechanicals, the utilitarian things, and all the various machines a house needs. New water heater, radon abatement system, new water softener, new electrial box, all new faucets and toilets, new roofs on the house and garage, rebuilding of the garage overhead door, new furance, new air conditioner, all new appliances, and so on. But did I do any decorating at all? No. The former owner slathered one color of white paint over the entire interior of the house prior to the sale, and it stayed that same color for the 14 years I was there. I never replaced the hideous toxic carpet. The same drapes are there today that were there when I moved in—only they've got a visible coating of dust now. The same wallpaper is in the bathroom, only now it's peeling.
And by the way, what the heck is up with that? I don't know if it's like this in other areas of the cournty, but in my area, anyway, the local custom seems to be that the bathrooms of any given house will be wallpapered, and it's just as likely that nowhere else in the house will there be any wallpaper. Why in the world would we put wallpaper, which peels if the humidity changes too much, in the one room of the house where the humidity changes all the time? That really makes no sense at all. And yet it's the local custom. I am completely neutral on the question of wallpaper—neither pro nor con—but it makes no sense at all in bathrooms.
Fix 'er up: That's not the only thing that makes no sense about real estate norms. As I mentioned, I'm fixing up my old home for sale. For decorating decisions, I got staging advice (staging is the current term for fixing up a house to sell) from real estate and decorating professionals (thanks, Stephanie and Karen!) as to what appeals to the widest range of buyers. The entire house is being painted neutrally, basically in adroit and complementary selections from the Universe of beige, and the carpet has also been selected to be as inoffensive as possible to the broadest range of potential buyers as possible. It's kind of a light-medium beige-brown with flecks to hide dirt and stains.I absolutely don't care what the paint colors or the carpet look like—I want the house to move, and whatever the pros think will sell best is fine with me.
But when you think of it, I'm picking out the paint and the carpet that someone else is going to have to live with for a long time. How does that make any sense? Wouldn't those people rather pick out their own carpet?
Actually, it makes sense in one way and one way only: which is that after buying a house, most people are cash-poor, and don't have any money for decorating. So they need to move into a place that's ready to live in.
But really, if we thought about it, we'd work out some way for people to spend the fix-'er-up money on their own new houses...the house they're moving into, not the one they're moving out of. I got to paint the walls of my new house (long story), and I'm very pleased I got to do that. Because I picked colors I liked. Rather than the Universe-of-beige varients that were there before. But that makes too much sense; it's definitely not the way things are done.
Community property: That does illustrate another of my theories, though, which is that a society's housing stock is essentially shared, communal property. Yes, it's private property...for a while, for as long as each owner owns it. But over its lifetime it belongs to many people, and so it's communal in a way as well. And that has a way of enforcing community norms, not only in building codes, but in architectural styles, the types and arrangements of rooms, and interior decorating styles.
Case in point, my kitchen counters. As you might know, granite countertops are all the rage now and have been for some time. Personally, I'm not a fan. They're too brittle-hard, and so is china—and when two brittle-hard surfaces meet, the more frangible of the two is more likely to break. I like laminate countertops. As with stainless steel for eating utensils, it seems like the ideal material for the job. Besides, the more fashionable something is, the more likely I am to want to do something else.
Beautiful! ...According to community standards!
I'm not complaining, mind you—my new kitchen is beautiful and I'm appreciating and enjoying it—even going so far as keeping it neat and clean. (What can I say, I'm inspired.) But guess who now has stylish granite countertops? That's right. Me. Because my new house is mine, but it hasn't always been mine, and it won't always be mine. Broadly speaking, the housing stock belongs to the community as whole, serially at least, and the community as a whole currently likes granite countertops.
And so it goes. I hope the people who buy my old house like the new carpet we just picked out for them. Me, I just have to figure out how I'm going to pay for their new carpet!
Mike
"Open Mike," which appears on Sunday, is when we let the TOP dog off the leash and let him wander. Arf!
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(To see all the comments, click on the "Comments" link below.)
Featured Comments from:
B.R. George: "Of course, the other side of the LX100 vs. 12–35mm equation is that in theory you get to keep the 12–35mm when you replace or upgrade your camera, so it probably has a somewhat longer life cycle. [Although as Wes Walker pointed out, the LX100 will go on closeout at the end of its lifecycle whereas the 12–35mm probably will not. —Ed.]
"And, relatedly, if you don't like the decisions they made about what camera they chose to throw in with the LX100 lens, you're stuck. My reaction when the G1X mark II (with basically the same image circle as Micro 4/3) was announced was that if that lens were available on its own as a Micro 4/3 lens, it would probably cost at least $800 by itself. But there might be some serious advantages to having a hypothetical stand-alone version lens to pair with one's preferred Micro 4/3 body—reading the G1X mark II reviews, I got the impression that some non-lens-related aspects of the camera compared unfavorably to some of the Micro 4/3 options, and might be holding the lens back.
"And of course there are other differences or potential differences in the present Panasonic comparison: LX100 lens has a serious compactness advantage, but 12–35mm is weather-sealed. And as far as I know we don't yet have much on which to make a direct comparison of optical performance (measurable or subjective).
"So it's complicated, depending on what you're looking for, and the LX100 announcement doesn't make me suddenly regret my Olympus 12–40mm (Mike, is there a reason you're not considering that for your E-M1?), but, as you say, the money-utility equation is really all over the place."
Nicholas Condon: "Wow, lots to comment on today! I'll try to be brief: 1) Another way to save big money on cameras (and lots of other things, as you learned with your washer and dryer) is to skip the top of the line. One can buy two Oly E-M10s for the cost of one E-M1; if you don't really and truly need the weather sealing, you can save the cost of a very nice lens by buying the cheaper model. 2) I love love love the idea of housing stock as community property. I am going to be pondering the consequences of that mode of thinking for days. 3) I hate granite countertops, too, and for exactly the reason you describe. I am clumsy, and I fear that I would become a mass murderer of crockery if I had them in my kitchen. And you are literally the first person I've ever read who has said the same thing; everyone else loves their pretty, pretty dishbreaker counters."
Carl Root: "I suspect several readers have recently bought and sold houses and, like me, will offer some helpful advice. Or at least, commiserate. I put new carpet in several rooms, only to have the buyer pull them up and install wood floors. Spent hours cleaning up the master bath (don't ask), only to find out that they didn't like the arrangement and gutted it.
"Now for the good part. I'm convinced that my photos are the reason it sold within twenty-four hours. He loved the photos online and wanted to be first in line to buy it. I don't consider myself a pro photographer, but I do know that some shots look better in the morning, others in the evening, and you can do a lot in Lightroom when the light doesn't cooperate. I wonder how much interest there would be in an article entitled 'Why photo enthusiasts should do their own home marketing photos.'"
Aaron Britton: "I would like to take your community as a whole towards residential buildings thought a little further. What you need to ponder further is it the community at large influencing these decisions on finishes, or the real estate / developer community pushing those decisions on the community at large. Here is my argument: the real estate agents and developers are creating residences with safe design features and finishes that sell a house per their market research. But like you commented, you as a person wanted different paint colors in your house and were happy that you had the opportunity to choose them.
"To draw an analogy from the camera industry, you have Canon and Nikon. Developing the same safe-selling cameras, but not developing anything innovative. Same with the real estate / developers, they create a safe house that will sell, but has nothing innovative about it. If anything it is constructed to the cheapest denomination possible that will make the highest profit possible.
"One other influence on the residential market that plays a bigger part in making these decisions (finishes, design and size of a house) is the house appraiser. The appraiser, who most of the time does not have any experience with design, concepts, and/or how a house functions, tells you the owner or the bank what a house is worth. All based on market research. And all of this influences the finishes at large as well as other decisions (from the size of the house, bigger is better, the amount of bathrooms, minimum three these days, and other items) in a residential building.
"I believe the problem lies in the industry (here residential buildings, but can apply to many other industries) becoming myopic or focused on one element, in this case money. It is not necessarily the community at large influencing decisions."
Mike replies: Good point. As a fer-instance, I tried to get flash water heaters installed in my old house. The plumber basically refused, saying nobody in the area is doing that. He used as an argument that it would hurt resale because potential buyers wouldn't understand it, but from his perspective he didn't want to do it because he didn't have the expertise with the new systems. And I'm sure he's telling people—and maybe himself—that he doesn't acquire the expertise because he doesn't get calls for the technology. But my case indicates that he does get calls for the technology—I can prove at least one—but that, when he does, he talks people out of wanting what they want. This is an indication of what tends to make the trades and the building codes slow to respond to new technology and innovation.
The other truth that realtors will tell you is that a house will sell much better when it is full of furniture and the smells of fresh baked frozen cookie dough. Have you considered painting the old house and then moving all of your belongings back in to make it more attractive to the realtors?
[Pierre, the fashion in this area is to do "vignettes," meaning little arrangements of furniture here and there, to suggest coziness and charm. On the other hand leaving any signs of yourself as an individual person is verboten, so it must be generic, nonspecific charm. And as you might expect, you can *rent* the furniture setups for the vignettes.... --Mike]
Posted by: Pierre Munson | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 04:39 PM
"But really, if we thought about it, we'd work out some way for people to spend the fix-'er-up money on their own new houses...the house they're moving into, not the one they're moving out of."
In my part of the county, it's fairly common for the seller to give a carpet/paint/other "allowance" rather than having the work done themselves. Basically, at closing, the seller takes a portion of the proceeds of the sale and immediately gives it back to the buyer to fix up the offending item the way they want.
Posted by: Andre | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 05:14 PM
I hear you about the whole "re-carpet, re-paint" thing. When we moved out of our last place though, we just left it unpainted. We figured that the new owner would want it painted his way - and we were right! He painted it a wild purple colour (or something like that!). On the other hand, our friend sold his place and painted the walls at great expense before moving out. We moved into our new place and painted one wall and then got tired. 6 years later, we have finally had it painted in colours that we like and had our kitchen done how we want it done - and neither is what anyone would have chosen! And I'm with you on laminate over granite - we have a nice light wood look laminate and it's beautiful.
Posted by: Wes Walker | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 05:34 PM
One thing I forgot - it was a long read - I find myself thinking I will wait and buy the LX100 instead of the 12-35 or 12-40. I figure the LX will eventually go on closeout and be even cheaper, whereas the lenses will probably hold their value indefinitely...
Posted by: Wes Walker | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 05:40 PM
You'll have to take up baking now, Mike. Those stone countertops are the perfect substrate for working with dough.
Posted by: Dave in NM | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 06:15 PM
"The former owners of this house took their washer and dryer with them..."
Strange what's important to folks in different countries, no moral judgement meant :-). Here we pick a sunny day and hang the washing out on a line. Or bring it inside on a rack.
I bought a second hand washer some 15 years ago for $30 or so and it's still going strong.
Posted by: David Sutton | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 06:19 PM
Re: Wallpaper in bathrooms. I don't know about the US, but many places in the UK I visited had carpeted toilets. Toilets with carpets. That can't be good.
Posted by: The Lazy Aussie | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 07:34 PM
I'll bet the optical look of the 10.9-34mm is not as good as that of the 12-35mm.
Posted by: Marcelo Guarini | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 07:49 PM
I spent part of 2014 making trips out to California in prep for retirement. I *thought* I wanted to move back to California so I could be closer to family, but, OMG, what a financial wake-up call this has been! Have you looked at the real estate prices out there? Plus California's tax situation is the worst in the nation to retire in according to Forbes. I am staying where I am at for now, and will let my family down easy.
In 2010 I paid $85,000 for an addition and remodeling on my current home that was built in 1992. I now have to pay $6,000 more because the builder did a poor job with the grading and drainage in the backyard. If it isn't one thing, its another. I was not liking the thought of putting my house up for sale anytime soon because in 2007, I too was paying for two homes so I know what your going through. My fingers are crossed your old home will sell quick after the paint and flooring.
Posted by: darr | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 08:03 PM
About those monolithic companies: It is fashionable in management circles (blessed are they who run in circles for they shall be called 'big wheel's) to foster competition among employees/divisions on the theory that it fosters innovation and greater profits. It is my observation however is that all it really fosters is competition.
Posted by: Jim Bullard | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 08:05 PM
I've bought and sold several houses over the past few years, and one thing we always did was to check out the potential sellers and buyers on the Internet, by name, to see if they had anything to say about the house, good or bad, in a non-sales context.
8~)
Posted by: John Camp | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 08:52 PM
Regarding the Panasonic 12–35mm zoom lens, I compared that lens with the Zuiko 12-40mm zoom lens.
I ended up buying the Zuiko since it had both a wider zoom range and was less expensive by $200.
In actual use, I still favor the Olympus kit lens: the Zuiko 12-50mm since it is smaller lighter and has a wider range. It is not as fast as the Zuiko 12-40mm but it works well in most situations where I make images.
Posted by: Robert Hudyma | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 09:40 PM
You're were right to be smitten with that 12-35 Panny f/2.8, it's one *helluva* lens. It's on my E-M1 99% of the time. And while the very attractive (to both of us, apparently) Panny LX100 has a great lens I'm sure, I would seriously doubt it would match the optical performance of the Panny 12-35 (not to mention the 12-35 has built-in optical stabilization). The reason is that when engineering tech products, there are always trade-offs between price and performance to be made. And, usually, as far as optics go, you get what you pay for. There is no way to engineer a truly superior optic cheaply; the physics and the requisite engineering and quality characteristics don't permit it. As such, it's highly unlikely that an entire camera that costs less than the Panny 12-35 will have a lens that outperforms it optically (read the lens review Roger Cicala wrote on the Panny 12-35; he was mightly impressed). Panny's puttin' all that extra dough for the 12-35 into the lens design, materials, and manufacturing.
Interestingly, I was in this same quandary earlier in the year on the Fuji end of things: I could get the Fuji X100S for about $1200, or for a few hundred less, get the Fuji 23mm f/1.4 prime. An actual camera or another lens. I ultimately decided on the Fuji 23 prime, and in retrospect, I'm glad I did. Much as the Fuji X100 series have a great 23 mm (35-e) f/2 lens (and they do), its simply NO MATCH for the Fuji 23mm f/1.4, which is one of the finest optics I've ever used from anyone, at anytime (and that includes the using amazing Canon 200/1.8).
So, at the end of the day, one has to think clearly about one's requirements in these shooting situations. The LX100 will be more compact and more convenient to use than the 12-35 on the E-M1. But I seriously doubt it will be able to match the Panny 12-35 optically and the delicious way with which it draws images. It's one of those "six of one, half dozen of the other" situations. Only you can decide which is right for you and why. But I would encourage one to think through one's requirements clearly first. ;-)
Best,
Stephen (who reflects on questions like this all the time...)
Posted by: Stephen Scharf | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 10:04 PM
you just need to do the fix up the old house photo sale fund.
Posted by: Steven Ralser | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 11:21 PM
It was interesting hearing you refer to yourself as a 'Hippie kind of guy' in relation to attitude and oevre. Which kind of nails down my lifestyle choice as well. Except I went the whole hog... gardens, orchard & critters. You know, that (almost forgotten) good old Hippie self sufficiency path. Same deal for dwelling; except I had to build all of mine. Lots of recycling.(Current abode is strawbale studio. Fantastic BTW - thanks for asking!) But I can only dream about trying some of the kit that gets to pass through those cold wizzened Wisconsin hands. But damn, I get to live real well on my 14k a year!
PS: Pentax K-5 with few old primes & third party lenses. EPL-5 with 2 kit zooms. Saving for the 25mm 1.8 or Sigma Art lens. Still have my Pentax Spotmatic II... and some film languishing in the shed with all the darkroom gear.
PSS: Would rather build from scratch than renovate. Commiserations.
Posted by: Dennis fairclough | Sunday, 21 September 2014 at 11:47 PM
Mike - houses don't have to be fixed up before they are sold, but they will sell more easily and for a higher price if they are. Sell-side real-estate professionals will always recommend fixing up since it makes their job easier, and they often have a stable of fixer-uppers in their keiretsu. If the market is hot enough a house will sell fixed-up or not, the seller then needs to decide if she will get her fix-up money back in a higher price.
I sold a house in Silicon Valley two years ago - as is, where is, and it sold in a week, for what looked like the going rate minus the cost (but not the aggravation and time) of a fix-up. A friend sold his house in Silicon Valley this year - he spent six months supervising a new kitchen and other remodeling on the advice of his real estate agent, he got the going rate. I liked how I spent my time better, but it's impossible to know for sure who got the better value.
Posted by: Don Craig | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 12:38 AM
"I absolutely don't care what the paint colors or the carpet look like—I want the house to move, and whatever the pros think will sell best is fine with me."
I'm feeling ya. Although, I only have one house, I feel like Tom Hanks in the Money Pit. I've been in the same house for 27+ yrs. Needs a new roof, interior/exterior painting, new flooring, kithen bathroom: Yul Brynner in the background going: Etc. Etc. Etc...
I need to fix 'er up and sell 'er. Where oh where is the money coming from ???
Posted by: Dwain Barefield | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 12:39 PM
I have to chime in about the amazingly low cost of reasonably good cameras and lenses these days. As long as you don't insist on having the latest and greatest.
Mike, you are to blame for my new travel kit. You posted about a sale on Panasonic G5 cameras at about the time the G6 came out. The G5 isn't the top of the line, nor is it the latest design. But it does a pretty good job, is easy to shoot with, has the 16mp sensor and turns out nice files. At $300 for the camera and lens, I couldn't resist. I'd been trying to find a compact travel camera and had not been happy with any of the super zooms that I tried.
But the G5 got me going and I now have a travel system. I picked up the little 15mm f/8 pancake lens, then the 9mm fisheye pancake. My wife got me the 45-200 zoom for Christmas. So now I have a 4-lens kit that covers a great range and all fits in a tiny bag that can go on my belt. And the whole kit cost less than $1000.
I already had a pinhole in M4/3 mount, so that goes in the bag too. And I got an adapter for my old lenses and I've found my ancient 50mm f/2 Nikkor makes a wonderful portrait lens on this camera.
I'm not getting rid of my Nikon D7000. But I'm in no hurry to buy another Nikon. It will take something pretty amazing in the way of improvements to get me to buy another camera at all any time soon.
Posted by: Dave Levingston | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 01:04 PM
The value of staging advice to sellers is debatable. A smart buyer looks at the aspects of a home that are hard-wired in and not easily changed: the location, the layout, the neighbors. If those are right, the current wall colors don't matter. That's the advice that applies best to my own property, which is so idiosyncratic and non-standard that I can hardly find comps to appraise it. But if your home is functionally just like the others on your block, maybe the stager's work really can set you apart. Maybe the question becomes, how many smart buyers in your area, vs., the other kind?
Consider the question from the perspective of the staging professional. They're paid to find problems and make changes. They all seem to think alike. As a real estate pro, I visit 400+ homes a year. The staged homes have a sameness that's almost surreal. Though I'm in Denver, wedged between the open plains and the Rockies, every staged home will have posters of the Eiffel Tower, food posters for "Vino"in the kitchen, plus that painting of that formal dinner party dancing on a stormy beach, with waiters holding umbrellas. Is it like that everywhere?
I agree with your position of the issue of fix-ups. I'd rather buy a blank slate. After you fix any visible problems, why not offer the buyer a $1000 cash painting and decorating allowance, kicked back after the sale?
Posted by: John McMillin | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 01:21 PM
"How does that make any sense? Wouldn't those people rather pick out their own carpet?"
I ask this all the time but as my wife always reminds me, most people 1) can't picture what rooms look like without pink carpet and purple walls and 2) they are lazy and don't want to do the work; they want everything already done for them. So what my wife and I have always done is give a low bid on a house saying, "Well, we lowered it $2000 because we will need to replace the pink carpet and paint the purple walls." Plus, as an added bonus to few people that can look beyond someone else's taste, these houses tend to sit on the market longer so the prices keep lowering in an effort to sell them. On a whole level of a house I can tell you if I like a floor plan, but if you show me a paint chip and ask if the room would be nice that color, I have no idea if I would like it until the whole room is painted that color. I just can't picture it in my brain. So, I sort of understand why people don't want the fear of designing their own rooms. On the other hand, I don't understand people who don't want to change things to suit their taste or can't look beyond one little negative when there are many positives.
I second your dislike of granite. It can also stain and you can't get the stains out. Plus, it does not seem green at all to me. It's heavy and usually comes from somewhere far away like India. Does India have any granite mountains left or is it all in American kitchens?
Posted by: JonA | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 01:24 PM
Our preparation for selling was awful, but in the end it worked well. We priced somewhat low and sold instantly, which we wanted. My major advantage is that my wife is quite good at the staging side of things. I handled the photography. As things progressed we hired more people to help, especially after the inspector condemned our back deck. We even did FSBO, a real adventure the first time around.
Posted by: John Krumm | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 01:27 PM
Mike, the why of a granite counter is clear: You bought your seller flecked carpet to hide his dirt, and your seller bought you a granite bench top to hide your breadcrumbs.
Posted by: Rod S. | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 01:41 PM
When I sold my house I did only three things. The first was to hire a company that came out with a huge dumpster and get rid of everything I did not want to take with me (like old lumber in the garage, an old swing set, mounds of household stuff, old furniture, attic stuff,etc). The guys were local and they charged $180 to do all the moving and hauling away. I had them out two times (so $360).
The next thing was have a professional type landscaper come out and for $800 I had him remove old bushes, put new mulch in the gardens (extensive), re-gravel the drive and walkways, and generally clean things up, including a quick once-over power wash of the outside of the house.
The last thing I did before my final move (by now the house was empty except for a mattress so sleep on), I had a two-man cleaning crew come out and scrub the place from top to bottom - the walls, floors, baseboards, woodwork, windows, the basement, cellar everything. Total cost $400, and they did it in two days. I was so impressed with how clean it was I did not want to move. The whole house smelled like lemons.
Total $1560. The house sold in one week. Not only because of what I did, I'm sure, but also market factors.
cfw
Posted by: cfw | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 02:35 PM
The consistent selling tip I hear from realtors (besides to always call them "Realtors-TM") is that good photos matter. They're my customers, of course, so I'm happy to hear that! If you have some good photos of your house to post online, you're more than halfway there. Let the pictures do the selling, before they visit.
You do have good photos of it, don't you?
Posted by: John McMillin | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 02:38 PM
Staging isn't just the repainting and remodeling, there's the whole business of putting fake furniture in there too. I do real estate photography on the side, a line of work I got into by meeting a gal named Mary Ellen Waite who does that for her extra income. I created her web site (that being my day job) and did the photography to populate it over at iowadesignsthatsell.com and I can say for certain, having worked with her, that houses that are properly staged sell a lot faster than the empty ones.
Posted by: Wolfeye | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 03:30 PM
I have to agree with The Lazy Aussie. Toilets with carpets are not a good idea. I'm from England so I know just what you mean. Those carpet sets with a cover for the toilet lid, a bit of carpet just in front of the pedestal and a bit to stand on to get splashed and mouldy while you are at the wash basin just boggle my mind.
My bathroom, too, has wallpaper. Woodchip. The same horrible paper is in every room in the place. The bathroom also has four areas of wall tile, and no two areas are at the same height.
At least the ceilings are not Artexed. I hate the stuff. My bungalow was built at a time when houses here were well built, and do not need flexible Artex on the ceiling to avoid the cracking that happens with the flimsy rubbish now commonly thrown up and described as a home.
Posted by: Roger Bradbury | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 05:22 PM
I've noticed the same thing about fixing up houses before selling them. This house and the previous house both got that from the former owners, and it was a bad deal all around in both cases. I felt really bad tearing out the painstakingly hand-laid ceramic mosaic countertops that the wife had done herself at the previous house -- but they were horrible to actually cook on. There ought to be a way to do it more sensibly -- less quick-and-dirty work, more careful work that somebody will love.
And I did not put in granite there or for the added counter in this house, for the reasons you give plus because the care instructions for granite are too daunting for me; I figure I'd ruin it. Which is amazing for an igneous rock; it ought to be really tough. Maybe the instructions are wrong, who knows?
Good luck selling! Risking the overlap like this is a big step. In addition to just costing money each month, delay also gives the market time to change, and that can be for you or against you on price -- but much worse, it can be against you on speed of sale.
Posted by: David Dyer-Bennet | Monday, 22 September 2014 at 11:11 PM
When we moved in, everywhere was painted the same off white - slowly we've repainted each room in different colours (only 1.5 more to go before we can start going around again). Seeing colour appearing in the house over a period of time reminds me of the movie 'Pleasantville' - the one about two modern kids who get caught up in a B&W 1950's sitcom world, but slowly they bring colour to that world.
Posted by: Chris Crowe | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 05:36 AM
Who knows what will sell a particular house.
True story:
My previous home sold to a couple (by my second listing realtor) that had, somehow, been discouraged from buying it by the first realtor that showed it to them. Of the two realtors, the second was, by far, the most successful realtor in the area. I believe it was not so much about the house itself, as it was about the realtor's ability to size up buyers. OBTW, the second realtor was a much less refined individual. A "man of the people," so to speak.
I suggest you do some research, if you have not already done so, on who sells the most houses in your area. I do not mean, which realty company sells the most houses. I mean, which individual realtor sells the most houses. Our previous house was much like you describe yours: all new mechanicals; New wiring; new roof; but lacking the final polish. Don't be in a rush to dump a bunch of money in the old house. Maybe consider throwing the pool table in instead. My wife loves pool. A nice pool table in the basement of a potential new home would supersede things like old carpets, paint, and drapes. The house is already empty, so buyers are already going to suspect there is pressure on the seller and will be compelled to low-ball on the bid. be cautious about sweetening the deal for them.
When it comes to realtors, there seem to be a couple of classifications. There are those who can sell the perfect house. There are those who have the ability to find/create the right buyer. The guy who sold our house was a guy who was well known in the community and seemed to know everybody. He knew who to go to when a house became available.
Posted by: Wayne | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 07:23 AM
What Carl doesn't say is there should also be an article on why sellers should *not* do their own photos.
This past fortnight, I've seen both mobile snaps (the pejorative is required) and red watermarks splashed by the estate agent in middle of the shot. And either party actually wants to sell the place?!
Posted by: Tim | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 08:52 AM
Referring to the lick-o-paint to sell the house, compare it to the frames around pictures/photos; a happy medium not to everyone's taste but a must nonetheless.
Posted by: m3photo | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 11:03 AM
But, Tim, you gave an example of bad work by professional agents, not sellers. And those of us who frequent places like TOP ought to be better photographers than the average home seller, don't ya think? Mike could even get his hands on a real wide-angle lens for the job, I bet.
Posted by: John McMillin | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 06:11 PM
"plus that painting of that formal dinner party dancing on a stormy beach, with waiters holding umbrellas. Is it like that everywhere?"
A good description of Jack Vettriano, The Singing Butler, 1992
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Singing_Butler
He's a self-taught and very successful Scottish genre painter who is outside the usual high flying "contemporary art" or the starving and not very successful artist scenes. A lot of the art world really hate him. The middle classes love him.
I see parallels between Jack Vettriano and a lot of photographers.
Posted by: Kevin Purcell | Tuesday, 23 September 2014 at 07:33 PM
Dear Mike,
The question of fixing up the house prior to sale and “staging” a house for sale (two different matters) does not have a single answer. It varies in both space and time. For example, here (Daly City) and now (2014) staging is pretty much necessary, as is delivering the house in “move-in” state, if you want the fastest sale at the best price.
At various times in the past, one, or the other, or both have not been true. The driving factors include how anxious buyers (collectively) are to be able to move in immediately, and how anxious they are to buy a house right now. Here in the San Francisco Bay Area, the former almost always dominates the buying populace… Except when the latter gets very high.
Also, what the local custom is (at that particular space-time locus); deviating from that, either positively or negatively, affects buyer's perceptions. Ditto, class. Upper-class (not uber-rich) houses are almost always staged on the north-mid Peninsula, regardless of what the middle-class custom may currently be.
Nobody who doesn't live in your area and know the current practices and expectations can give you advice on this, no matter how experienced they are with real estate. Your best guide on this is your realtor; she's interested in moving the property and, assuming she's getting a percentage commission, getting the best price for it. You should follow her advice. But you should also make sure she is aware of your situation. If you have cash flow problems, you need to let her know. Ditto, time constraints on the sale. Those will both affect what she decides is the optimum strategy.
pax \ Ctein
[ Please excuse any word-salad. MacSpeech in training! ]
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Posted by: ctein | Wednesday, 24 September 2014 at 02:56 PM